Names and Expectations

An intriguing paper by David Figlio.

This paper investigates the question of whether teachers treat children differentially on the basis of factors other than observed ability, and whether this differential treatment in turn translates into differences in student outcomes. I suggest that teachers may use a child's name as a signal of unobserved parental contributions to that child's education, and expect less from children with names that "sound" like they were given by uneducated parents. These names, empirically, are given most frequently by Blacks, but they are also given by White and Hispanic parents as well. I utilize a detailed dataset from a large Florida school district to directly test the hypothesis that teachers and school administrators expect less on average of children with names associated with low socio-economic status, and these diminished expectations in turn lead to reduced student cognitive performance. Comparing pairs of siblings, I find that teachers tend to treat children differently depending on their names, and that these same patterns apparently translate into large differences in test scores.

I can't say I'm surprised by this result, as it is in accordance with results of studies done on employment discrimination, i.e., that having a "black sounding" name is enough to slash one's chances of snagging interviews by as much as 33%, even with the very same credentials. I'll file this paper under "must read later."

PS: A Washington Post article on Figlio's paper.

Comments

[Aidan Kehoe]

He doesn't say if he asked the teachers if there was a reason why they offered "Jazzmyn" and "Chlo'e," fewer places in gifted student programs and enrichment classes. In those teachers' places, I would judge that kids without names that necessitated suppressed laughter every time they were said, probably have fewer idiots in their home environment, and that better home support would mean they'd take greater benefit from those programs, and be less likely to crash out of those of them that involved pressure.

It does seem to me that schoolyard bullying must be very anaemic in the US, if there is a significant number of children that actually have these names.

[Abiola Lapite]

"I would judge that kids without names that necessitated suppressed laughter every time they were said, probably have fewer idiots in their home environment, and that better home support would mean they'd take greater benefit from those programs, and be less likely to crash out of those of them that involved pressure."

1 - What makes you think such names "necessitate suppressed laughter?" That in itself is a marker of prejudice: there's nothing inherently funnier about "Jazzmyn" or "Chlo'e" than there is "Adam" or "John." I'm sure many anti-Irish bigots of an earlier era would have found "Aidan" comical too, so I don't see why you'd buy into such thinking when the shoe's on someone else's foot.

2 - Why do you assume that any given name is an indicator that one would have "idiots" in one's home environment, anyway? Look at it from a slightly different perspective: would you be so willing to make such an assumption if this study were in an English setting in the 1950s, and the markers were Irish surnames?

3 - Most importantly, the fact of the matter is that Figlio doesn't base his conclusions on mere subjective observation: his point is that even when test scores are *equal* between groups, teachers still discriminate against students who have names with perceived low SES, e.g. a kid with a name like "Robert" has a better chance of getting into a gifted program than one named "Tyrese", even if both have the very same test results. Why should anyone care about a child's imagined lack of home support in deciding whether or not to give him/her a chance at better things? If anything, one ought to be *more* supportive of such children, not less.

The long and short of it is that I don't find your response in the least bit convincing.

[Aidan Kehoe]

Because they were invented _ex nihilo,_ in the West, a culture where that is almost never true for given names; the kid certainly wasn't named after one of their grandparents, nor after some important social figure their parent(s) admired--I can't imagine anyone having to suppress laughter at a given name of Martin Luther King or even Malcolm X or Louis Farrakhan. ("David Duke" as a given name, now, there would be some dumb parents.)

I mean, how exactly do you grow up in the US and not notice that once you get past, say, fifteen, you only rarely come across new given names among the locals? That your child is not yet a pop star and if you name it something you just invented because you like how it's spelled, it won't become one, it'll just sound like its parents stopped paying attention to the wider world after the age of twelve?

Different rules for naming kids apply in different cultures--IIRC, picking a random word that you like the sound and Kanji of is the normal run of things in Japan, for example; I've no idea how things work among Yoruba speakers?--and when those other rules are followed by people with _some tenable link_ to one of those other cultures, well and good. But ignoring the only large culture you have any participation in when naming your child is, ceteris paribus, not an indication of good judgement.

So, yeah, I find the names funny because of the apparent lack of cultural awareness on the part of those who gave them. I say fuck you if you think that means I will approach their bearers with anything other than an open mind, at least in contexts where they're not relying on their parents for support. With regard to the Irish-surname hypothetical; yeah, I would make the same judgement, though not as strongly--the majority of Irish immigrants there at that time were straight off the land, and the church took a big proportion of the more motivated, ambitious and poor men of that class--but those in England had had the initiative to get out, and had some the immigrant's work ethic thing going. Watch some Spike Milligan from the sixties and seventies for lots of dumb Paddy sketches, and this from someone who loved the place; there was very much a grain of truth to the image.

It's not "better things" it's "a better thing" in each of these decisions and if Tyrese's home and family environment are encouraging him to become an auto mechanic--and there are many such home environments, and of _course_ the teacher should meet the parents and find out, and it may well be that the teachers were slacking off on this--and if this activity will be one more thing for Robert to put on his college application, then it should go to Robert. There's no shame in having a career where the barrier to entry is your high school diploma.

[dsquared]

[I'm sure many anti-Irish bigots of an earlier era would have found "Aidan" comical too]

I can confirm that "Aidan Kehoe" would have had a fart's chance in a hurricane of being put into the gifted kids stream as recently as the 1970s, and would have had to put up with every single teacher in the school asking if his parents were unable to spell "Adrian"; I was about to make this point myself.

[dsquared]

[but those in England had had the initiative to get out, and had some the immigrant's work ethic thing going]

Absolutely not true; they were brought over in gangs by McAlpine's and had an immigrant's violence and petty crime thing going.

[So, yeah, I find the names funny because of the apparent lack of cultural awareness on the part of those who gave them. I say fuck you if you think that means I will approach their bearers with anything other than an open mind]

You've already said that you think that their parents are idiots and they're more likely to drop out of school programmes, so you in fact are not willing to approach them with an open mind and the time for saying "fuck you" is long since gone.

[dsquared]

and furthermore, there's nothing culturally insensitive or invented about giving your child names like "Winston", "Algernon", "Germaine" or "Antoine", all of which have fine pedigrees; or rather they did until they became popular with Jamaican immigrants, and I'd suspect that a replication of the study in the UK would have found these to be toxic as well.

[Abiola Lapite]

"I say fuck you if you think that means I will approach their bearers with anything other than an open mind, at least in contexts where they're not relying on their parents for support."

I didn't realize students relied on their parents to do their studying for them ...

"if Tyrese's home and family environment are encouraging him to become an auto mechanic--and there are many such home environments, and of _course_ the teacher should meet the parents and find out, and it may well be that the teachers were slacking off on this--and if this activity will be one more thing for Robert to put on his college application, then it should go to Robert."

In other words, to them that have, more shall be given ... I'm afraid I can't endorse a world-view in which it is precisely those who have to struggle to get ahead who are held back because some person or other takes it upon himself to make judgements about the likely commitment of their parents. By your judgment, whenever we're faced with two students of equal performance, and one's from a well-off family from the suburbs while the other's from a working class background, we ought always to decide in favor of the former - a position which would strike even the most hard-hearted individuals as perverse.

[Delmore Macnamara]

"Look at it from a slightly different perspective: would you be so willing to make such an assumption if this study were in an English setting in the 1950s, and the markers were Irish surnames?"

I don't know about the 50s; my impression is that anti-Irish sterotyping in mainland Britain was subsiding somewhat by then, but certainly my great-grandfather found it useful to change his surname from "Macnamara" to "Delmore" when he moved to Yorkshire from Ireland at the turn of the last century. My grandfather always claimed he got the name off of a tin of cling peaches in syrup.

The question remains why someone aware of the existence of class, race etc. prejudice would voluntarily expose their children to further prejudice on the grounds of "having a weird name". Clearly no names are _intrinsically_ weird but in the context of conventional American orthography, "Jazzmyn" for "Jasmine" does seem (to an outsider) a bit odd; is this a spelling error or a deliberate choice?

I suspect if the study were repeated in England, the "low expectation" names might (*unjustifiably*) include Wayne, Dean, Sharon & Tracy...

[Delmore Macnamara]

"By your judgment, whenever we're faced with two students of equal performance, and one's from a well-off family from the suburbs while the other's from a working class background, we ought always to decide in favor of the former - a position which would strike even the most hard-hearted individuals as perverse. "

I don't understand this point; I should have thought the more appropriate comparison as respects name prejudice would be between two equally-performing students, both from working class backgrounds, differing only in "weirdness" of christian name.

It might be uncharitable to favour the kid with the "sensible" name, but such a choice would not be inconsistent with generally favouring a kid from a working class background over a scion of the bourgeoisie (which seems kind of an odd preference for a libertarian; once again my prejudices about libertarians are confounded by Abiola...)

[Aidan Kehoe]

""I didn't realize students relied on their parents to do their studying for them ...""

"Support." "Robert, have you done your homework?" vs. "Tyrene, where did you put the grits?" It is important.

""By your judgment, whenever we're faced with two students of equal performance, and one's from a well-off family from the suburbs while the other's from a working class background, we ought always to decide in favor of the former - a position which would strike even the most hard-hearted individuals as perverse.""

No, we should decide in favour of the one who will get more benefit from scarce resources at hand. If there are, say, limited machine room facilities available in the school, and Robert and Tyrene get the same marks in the introductory aptitude test, give it to Tyrene.

If Tyrene shows better aptitude at American football, give him more access to the sports ground, so he can get a scholarship on that basis, if he wants it.

And, _there is no shame in having a job for which the entry requirements are the high school diploma._

[Frank McGahon]

Because they were invented _ex nihilo,_ in the West, a culture where that is almost never true for given names

What a load of rot! The Eastern seaboard of Ireland is awash in Gaelic names which were rare/almost extinct 100 years ago. Go back through any family tree in "The Pale" and you will find few Sadhbhs, Tadhgs, Aoifes etc. These names are selected for reasons other than to honour some dead relative. Also, some of the most popular names among Irish-Americans are makey-uppy ersatz Irish names such as "Brianna", "Kayla", "Cori", "Cody" and "Shayla".

[Aidan Kehoe]

""Absolutely not true; they were brought over in gangs by McAlpine's and had an immigrant's violence and petty crime thing going.""

That's a low bar for an absolute.

[So, yeah, I find the names funny because of the apparent lack of cultural awareness on the part of those who gave them. I say fuck you if you think that means I will approach their bearers with anything other than an open mind]

""You've already said that you think that their parents are idiots and they're more likely to drop out of school programmes, so you in fact are not willing to approach them with an open mind and the time for saying "fuck you" is long since gone.""

I hypothesise those things, very tentatively, _based on the information I have._ I want more information so I can continue with them or dismiss them. As is most people's approach with limited information. I hypothesise that some of your grandparents were born in Central Europe, based on your surname, that you grew up in the south of England--because that's where most of the 20th century European immigration to the UK ended up--and that the typos in the Guardian don't annoy you at all, because I can't imagine someone being both energetically against foxhunting and into getting the details right at the same time. ("Votes for snails!") But I can't imagine any of those actually affecting our interaction until some of it's confirmed.

[Abiola Lapite]

""Support." "Robert, have you done your homework?" vs. "Tyrene, where did you put the grits?" It is important."

That Robert and Tyrese should *still* have the same grades despite the (supposed) lack of support in the latter case is a testament to Tyrese's drive, *not* an argument for discriminating against him.

"No, we should decide in favour of the one who will get more benefit from scarce resources at hand. If there are, say, limited machine room facilities available in the school, and Robert and Tyrene get the same marks in the introductory aptitude test, give it to Tyrene.

If Tyrene shows better aptitude at American football, give him more access to the sports ground, so he can get a scholarship on that basis, if he wants it."

This does not make sense. Why the assumption that the less privileged kid is the one better able to make use of machine tools and sports equipment? Middle class parents are better able to afford special tutoring and private coaches, so to be consistent, you ought to favor the bettter off here too; instead what you seem to be doing is feeding off the assumption that the "lower orders" are better fitted for certain jobs.

Your stance is analogous to my arguing that if two people manage to run the same time in a race even though one has a giant weight attached to his left leg, we ought to give the award to the man who ran unencumbered: a person who manages to do as well as another in the face of adversities unknown to that other person would likely do *even better* if the scales were less tilted in his adversery's favor - which is just the opposite of what you're advocating.

"And, _there is no shame in having a job for which the entry requirements are the high school diploma._"

Then the more privileged children should have no qualms making do with such jobs themselves ...

In any case, this is all theoretical, as you haven't provided the slightest bit of evidence to support the belief that "funny" names are a signal of inferior parental support.

[Abiola Lapite]

By the way, I think this final passage from the abstract is worth stating again, as it goes DIRECTLY against any notion that this discrimination has anything to do with signals of parental support:

"Comparing pairs of siblings, I find that teachers tend to treat children differently depending on their names, and that these same patterns apparently translate into large differences in test scores."

Notice that we're talking about comparisons between *pairs of siblings*, i.e, children with the *same* parents!

[Aidan Kehoe]

Frank: The use of Irish given names on the east coast was, as you say, not
ex-nihilo; there was a wider cultural context--they were still used in the West, part of the same country and culture--and a history to them. As to the Irish-American names, I have to say I find them funny; but I can well imagine them easily confused with ones you or I would not, in the American context, and having some of the cultural context rub off on them,

[Abiola Lapite]

"The question remains why someone aware of the existence of class, race etc. prejudice would voluntarily expose their children to further prejudice on the grounds of "having a weird name"."

As a statement of pride and defiance, of course. Look at the context in which said names are given, a culture in which nearly everything African-American is regarded as inferior by definition: giving a child a "black" name in such a context is a way of saying "I want my child to grow up with his head held high about who he is."

Although my own circumstances are different, I myself am dead set against changing my name for the sake of convenience, despite the fact that I'm well aware of the disadvantages that go with having a foreign-sounding first name; self respect is worth some inconvenience.

[Aidan Kehoe]

Abiola:

[1] Sure. So, go Tyrene. If that drive keeps up, he'll get better marks than Robert next time, get the opportunity, and this debate won't be relevant. If he is going to get out of his familial and cultural environment, he will have to have a hell of a lot of drive, and this will happen.

[2] The access to machine tools was in the context of Tyrene's familial encouragement to become a mechanic. The sports equipment comment was, indeed, nothing specific to Tyrene, and I should have added an "or Robert" there too.

[3] It's not a giant weight. It's a cultural, familial predispositions in different directions. Probably more effective in the long run. People who shake off the immediate family culture they grew up with are the exception, not the rule.

[4] I'm sure many of the more privileged children would be happy to do those jobs, but for parental pressure.

[6] My comment on the possibility of the teachers' slacking off was exactly addressed to the final passage of the abstract.

And, [5], indeed, I haven't provided the slightest bit of evidence to support that belief, and I have no intention of getting any--I'm not a sociologist, and I'm happy enough with the hypothesis myself that I have no desire to pitch the experiment to one. So, that brings our exchange to an end. Enjoy your afternoon!

[Aidan Kehoe]

Nnngh. s/Thyrene/Thyrese/g there.

[Frank McGahon]

"but I can well imagine them easily confused with ones you or I would not"

Speak for yourself. I don't find any names intrinsically amusing (although I do admit to wondering why parents name their children after their own surname - eg. Neville Neville or Brian O'Brien), I'm aware that my own surname presents pronunciation problems outside of Ireland - who am I to knock others' names?

[Delmore Macnamara]

"self respect is worth some inconvenience.". Indeed, but the question is how much? From where I'm standing great-grandad's pragmatic decision to name himself after his groceries appears more rational than my father's sentimental decision to change the family name back again.

On the other hand, after his name change & adoption of RP, greatgrandad was presumably effectively indiscernible at first & maybe second glance from the natives, so there were no further barriers to scaling the dizzy heights of petty bourgeoisdom If the Irish had been a "visible minority", perhaps the "pride & defiance" option would have seemed relatively more attractive in the context of maintaining self-esteem.

My only query is this: Is self-esteem as great an aid to social mobility as some American self-help books suggest? Pre Vatican II Catholicism was not known for promoting self-esteem among the laity (particularly not among religiously educated children; my father claims he still flinches when he sees a nun) but their religion doesn't seem to have held my forebears back particularly in the recent past.

Frank McGahon certainly is a pure soul; he is probably holy enough that he finds toilet jokes unfunny rather than merely objectionable. For my own part, & even as an avowed cultural relativist, I have to admit to suppressing laughter when I was first introduced to a Lancastrian friend called Royston Shufflebotham & to a client called Bumstead (all his children have chosen to rename themselves Stead).

[Frank McGahon]

Frank McGahon certainly is a pure soul;

Not at all!, Perhaps I should rephrase it. I consider it crass to make fun of people's given names.

[dsquared]

[So, go Tyrene. If that drive keeps up, he'll get better marks than Robert next time, get the opportunity, and this debate won't be relevant.]

Why not? Since you've already decided that black kids don't really have the right sort of family to be worth educating (presumably it's their "culture"), why should we let a few marks stand between little Robert and the college transcript?

[Abiola Lapite]

"If that drive keeps up, he'll get better marks than Robert next time, get the opportunity, and this debate won't be relevant. If he is going to get out of his familial and cultural environment, he will have to have a hell of a lot of drive, and this will happen."

If he has to contend with plenty of people who believe as you do that the scales ought to be weighted against him, what's to stop him from coming to the (perfectly rational) conclusion that additional effort on his part is a waste of time?

"[3] It's not a giant weight."

How do you know this? And on the assumption that you're right, what justification is there for bringing such a minor factor into the balance anyway, especially to discriminate against the underprivileged?

"It's a cultural, familial predispositions in different directions. Probably more effective in the long run. People who shake off the immediate family culture they grew up with are the exception, not the rule."

And your answer to this is to reinforce said dispositions, thereby confirming the wisdom of the naysayers who tell ambitious children from deprived backgrounds that they'll never amount to anything by following the straight and narrow path in a system rigged against them. Talk about self-fulfilling prophecies.

[Jim]

We are talking about to separate instances of discrimination in this discussion. One has to do with the way teachers perceive and treat students and the other has to do with the way prospectiev employers select applicants for interviews. Employers complain continually about teachers'unconcern with preparing students for life beyond school, so there is probably a good-sized gap in the two sets of perceptions and expectations. As for teachers, they can as easily show favoritism a kid they presume to think comes from a less-than-optimal home - they have a real weak spot for stray puppies and are perfectly willing to inflict their pity and nurture on anyone too young or weak to resist.

Names like Tyree or Lashondra are not specifically "black" names; black students call those "ghetto" names. The issue is class rather than racial discrimination. That's of no help at all to a kid that happen to fall into that category too.

Names like Cody may or may not be made-up Gaelic names, but they are common in Colorado, deep in the dark Protestant heart of America and certainly have more to do with Wlliam "Buffalo Bill" Cody than anything else.
Harlan and Crystal and so on fall in this demographic too.

And that goes to the employment discrimination issue. It matters what kind of job you are interviewing for, doesn't it? If you are looking for work as a mechanic, Jimmy get hired before James. On the other hand a stock broker named Lester is not have the same chance with customers that Reed or Charles will have, and damn what the boss or hiring manager happens to giggle at.

[Aidan Kehoe]

Wow, such tenacity! I should go, but.

Daniel: I think that naming a child Thyrese is symptom of bad judgement. "Don't really have the right sort of family to be worth educating" is a huge leap from that. Should that actually reflect your interpretation of what I think, I have no real interest in talking with you, and bye.

Abiola: This is not "the scales ought to be weighed against him." This is

"Until such time as he overcomes the idiotic impression given by his first name and develops a personality that clearly reflects his go-getting attitude and intelligence, scarce educational resources, in those very rare cases where he is in direct competition with someone of the same grades and a more conventionally academically successful background, for some academic-oriented prize, that prize should go to the other, because, given the information available to those evaluating them, the other will probably use it better."

which is less succinct and pithy than how you expressed it, but much more exact. And it also will affect his life much less than how you expressed it.

With regard to the "self-fulfilling prophecies" supposition; perhaps there's an element of that, but it's something that is overcome, and has been often by entire tribes, for want of a better word. The Jews and the East Asians in the US are the stereotypical examples, while the Germans in Kazakhstan are perhaps lesser-known, but I am pretty convinced that Irish, British and Belgian universities will be full of West Africans in ten years' time.